by Jason Joyner | Aug 13, 2008 | Blog, CBA, christian fiction, fantasy, reading, speculative fiction, Stephenie Meyer, vampires
If you missed the first post, there were very good comments related to vampires and such in Christian fiction. One of the commenters was Sue Dent, who wrote the mentioned Never Ceese novel.
Evangeline noted my objective take on it – thanks. I was trying to present it evenly to see what people came up with before I threw in my own 2 cents. There are a few different facets to this discussion, so I don’t think it is a simple “yes it is eviiiiiil” or “no, there’s no problem”.
Sue brought out the importance of defining what is meant by Christian fiction. I was referring to the notion of the CBA/ECPA. As Sue noted, this is an umbrella group that is responsible for a certain type of “Christian fiction”, a type that usually gets ownership of that moniker. It is evangelical and conservative in outlook, and there are certain unwritten rules with these type of rules: no cussing, no sex (unless in marriage, and not on page), and as Sue mentioned, certain literary images like vampires, werewolves, etc., would not be generally welcome. (Oddly enough, you can have mass murderers, super assassins, and a high body count, but that’s another post…) “CBA” is almost a brand, but religious or Christian books are not limited to it. Very prominent examples of non-CBA Christian books would be the award-winning Gilead and Peace Like a River, and Sue’s novels. So you likely wouldn’t find a vampire novel in a Christian bookstore due to the CBA, as Sue mentions.
Evangeline talked about vampires as good objects for symbolism, metaphors, or allegory. This could potentially be a worthy use of the undead in CBA fiction. It would take a compelling author with a bold statement of faith to pull it off, likely.
Carole had interesting, thoughtful insights about the possibility of salvation for vampires, based on whether they were “fallen” men or demons. She also notes that vampires often act as a “bad boy” for the good girl to redeem, which might be a little prejudiced toward the “hot male vampires” LOL.
What are my thoughts? Jumbled as usual. I’ll list some out.
1. Regarding the Twilight series specifically, I have finished Twilight and am almost done with New Moon. I share Evangline’s concern about the sensualness of the series – even though Meyers keeps the clothes on and the physical touching limited to arms and faces, she still has a gift for romance and sexual tension. I wouldn’t want a young daughter of mine to read them. I also don’t like that Bella’s desire for immortality comes from wanting to become a vampire like Edward, over God’s ways.
2. We discussed the Twilight series in a home group/Bible study. A few people automatically didn’t like the idea of some many kids reading about vampires and werewolves, considering them evil and demonic, and wondering if Christians should be opening themselves up to such influences. I remember reading Dracula for high school, and my pastor’s wife cautioned me to be prayed up for it, as she read it and felt darkness from it. Considering the Twilight series, I told the group I couldn’t judge it without reading it for myself.
3. I have experienced evil influence from entertainment before. I used to play Dungeons and Dragons with friends around 9th-10th grade. We didn’t go for real heavy use of demons (mostly orcs and the like, Lord of the Ring-ish) and we always made our characters religion “Christian” on the player sheet. Still, it got to us. We had a sleep over one night where we got pretty freaked out with some weird stuff going on. I was the first to leave the group, feeling it was a bad situation. After this these good friends turned on me and I had some bad experiences with them. I wouldn’t be against any role-playing game, but I would not want my kids to play D&D specifically.
4. I have argued before for freedom for a Christian artist to produce the art they feel they should make. I wouldn’t condemn a Christian for using elements that I felt uncomfortable with, but I would use discernment whether it would be something for me to partake in or not.
5. Vampires and other mythological, typically evil creatures should be used carefully, but I think there is room for them to be used in a conscientious manner. I can’t help thinking of C.S. Lewis using witches, giants, the Greek god Bacchus, and other pagan-type supernatural events in his stories. A modern master of using the supernatural for a truly Godly end is Stephen Lawhead in many of his books.
6. Are vampires in essence a perversion of the gospel with their life coming from stealing the blood of people, as opposed to the life-giving power of the blood of Christ? This just came to me while writing this post – don’t know if I have the answer.
I think that’s more than enough to chew on for now. I’ll let y’all sink your teeth into it (grooooan).
by Jason Joyner | Aug 13, 2008 | Blog, CBA, christian fiction, fantasy, reading, speculative fiction, Stephenie Meyer, vampires
If you missed the first post, there were very good comments related to vampires and such in Christian fiction. One of the commenters was Sue Dent, who wrote the mentioned Never Ceese novel.
Evangeline noted my objective take on it – thanks. I was trying to present it evenly to see what people came up with before I threw in my own 2 cents. There are a few different facets to this discussion, so I don’t think it is a simple “yes it is eviiiiiil” or “no, there’s no problem”.
Sue brought out the importance of defining what is meant by Christian fiction. I was referring to the notion of the CBA/ECPA. As Sue noted, this is an umbrella group that is responsible for a certain type of “Christian fiction”, a type that usually gets ownership of that moniker. It is evangelical and conservative in outlook, and there are certain unwritten rules with these type of rules: no cussing, no sex (unless in marriage, and not on page), and as Sue mentioned, certain literary images like vampires, werewolves, etc., would not be generally welcome. (Oddly enough, you can have mass murderers, super assassins, and a high body count, but that’s another post…) “CBA” is almost a brand, but religious or Christian books are not limited to it. Very prominent examples of non-CBA Christian books would be the award-winning Gilead and Peace Like a River, and Sue’s novels. So you likely wouldn’t find a vampire novel in a Christian bookstore due to the CBA, as Sue mentions.
Evangeline talked about vampires as good objects for symbolism, metaphors, or allegory. This could potentially be a worthy use of the undead in CBA fiction. It would take a compelling author with a bold statement of faith to pull it off, likely.
Carole had interesting, thoughtful insights about the possibility of salvation for vampires, based on whether they were “fallen” men or demons. She also notes that vampires often act as a “bad boy” for the good girl to redeem, which might be a little prejudiced toward the “hot male vampires” LOL.
What are my thoughts? Jumbled as usual. I’ll list some out.
1. Regarding the Twilight series specifically, I have finished Twilight and am almost done with New Moon. I share Evangline’s concern about the sensualness of the series – even though Meyers keeps the clothes on and the physical touching limited to arms and faces, she still has a gift for romance and sexual tension. I wouldn’t want a young daughter of mine to read them. I also don’t like that Bella’s desire for immortality comes from wanting to become a vampire like Edward, over God’s ways.
2. We discussed the Twilight series in a home group/Bible study. A few people automatically didn’t like the idea of some many kids reading about vampires and werewolves, considering them evil and demonic, and wondering if Christians should be opening themselves up to such influences. I remember reading Dracula for high school, and my pastor’s wife cautioned me to be prayed up for it, as she read it and felt darkness from it. Considering the Twilight series, I told the group I couldn’t judge it without reading it for myself.
3. I have experienced evil influence from entertainment before. I used to play Dungeons and Dragons with friends around 9th-10th grade. We didn’t go for real heavy use of demons (mostly orcs and the like, Lord of the Ring-ish) and we always made our characters religion “Christian” on the player sheet. Still, it got to us. We had a sleep over one night where we got pretty freaked out with some weird stuff going on. I was the first to leave the group, feeling it was a bad situation. After this these good friends turned on me and I had some bad experiences with them. I wouldn’t be against any role-playing game, but I would not want my kids to play D&D specifically.
4. I have argued before for freedom for a Christian artist to produce the art they feel they should make. I wouldn’t condemn a Christian for using elements that I felt uncomfortable with, but I would use discernment whether it would be something for me to partake in or not.
5. Vampires and other mythological, typically evil creatures should be used carefully, but I think there is room for them to be used in a conscientious manner. I can’t help thinking of C.S. Lewis using witches, giants, the Greek god Bacchus, and other pagan-type supernatural events in his stories. A modern master of using the supernatural for a truly Godly end is Stephen Lawhead in many of his books.
6. Are vampires in essence a perversion of the gospel with their life coming from stealing the blood of people, as opposed to the life-giving power of the blood of Christ? This just came to me while writing this post – don’t know if I have the answer.
I think that’s more than enough to chew on for now. I’ll let y’all sink your teeth into it (grooooan).
by Jason Joyner | Aug 5, 2008 | Blog, CBA, christian fiction, fantasy, speculative fiction, Stephenie Meyer, vampires
Two weeks ago the Christian Sci-fi and Fantasy blog tour featured DragonLight by Donita K. Paul. The question was raised if dragons were an acceptable subject matter for Christian fiction authors. I had some good response, and everyone seemed to agree that dragons could be used as good or evil depending on context and not contradicting something clear in the Bible.
My question of the week plays off of this topic and the hot book for the weekend – the fourth book in the Twilight series by Stephenie Meyer, Breaking Dawn. For those who have been in a cave recently, the Twilight series is the hottest thing in youth fiction that has crossed boundaries into all ages. It features a love story between teens Bella and Edward. Bella is a clumsy, ordinary girl, while Edward is a typical hero – fantastically beautiful, pleasantly scented, and he’s a vampire. Oh, that last part may not be so typical…
The question: Can vampires or related creatures (werewolves, etc.) be a viable component of Christian fiction? Specifically, can vampires be considered good? Would it be acceptable to have “Christian” vampires?
Is there a conflict with vampires generally considered from an evil origin? If they are undead, how can they fit in a worldview that entails heaven and hell?
I didn’t realize until searching Amazon for this post how many vampire novels are out there. I know of one considered Christian: Never Ceese, by Sue Dent, who had werewolf and vampire leads. I didn’t read it when it was featured for a blog tour, I just posted the promotional info. Apparently there is a sequel (Forever Richard) coming out soon.
What say you? I just started reading Twilight, so I am far from knowing what Meyer does with the characters, and I haven’t really thought about this before. Can it be done? Should it be done? Fantasy has the advantage of being able to re-write rules when world-building, but are there rules for Christian fiction that shouldn’t be crossed, other than heresy and explicit depictions of sin?
(BTW, my wife happened to be at our local Barnes and Noble on Friday night when the release party for Breaking Dawn was going on. Wow. There were a ton of folks, with many girls and young women decked out in prom outfits or Gothic/black clothing, along with the scattered classic vampire. For sleepy Idaho Falls, there was a lot of interest. Quite the stir caused by a stay-at-home mom in Arizona!)
by Jason Joyner | Aug 5, 2008 | Blog, CBA, christian fiction, fantasy, speculative fiction, Stephenie Meyer, vampires
Two weeks ago the Christian Sci-fi and Fantasy blog tour featured DragonLight by Donita K. Paul. The question was raised if dragons were an acceptable subject matter for Christian fiction authors. I had some good response, and everyone seemed to agree that dragons could be used as good or evil depending on context and not contradicting something clear in the Bible.
My question of the week plays off of this topic and the hot book for the weekend – the fourth book in the Twilight series by Stephenie Meyer, Breaking Dawn. For those who have been in a cave recently, the Twilight series is the hottest thing in youth fiction that has crossed boundaries into all ages. It features a love story between teens Bella and Edward. Bella is a clumsy, ordinary girl, while Edward is a typical hero – fantastically beautiful, pleasantly scented, and he’s a vampire. Oh, that last part may not be so typical…
The question: Can vampires or related creatures (werewolves, etc.) be a viable component of Christian fiction? Specifically, can vampires be considered good? Would it be acceptable to have “Christian” vampires?
Is there a conflict with vampires generally considered from an evil origin? If they are undead, how can they fit in a worldview that entails heaven and hell?
I didn’t realize until searching Amazon for this post how many vampire novels are out there. I know of one considered Christian: Never Ceese, by Sue Dent, who had werewolf and vampire leads. I didn’t read it when it was featured for a blog tour, I just posted the promotional info. Apparently there is a sequel (Forever Richard) coming out soon.
What say you? I just started reading Twilight, so I am far from knowing what Meyer does with the characters, and I haven’t really thought about this before. Can it be done? Should it be done? Fantasy has the advantage of being able to re-write rules when world-building, but are there rules for Christian fiction that shouldn’t be crossed, other than heresy and explicit depictions of sin?
(BTW, my wife happened to be at our local Barnes and Noble on Friday night when the release party for Breaking Dawn was going on. Wow. There were a ton of folks, with many girls and young women decked out in prom outfits or Gothic/black clothing, along with the scattered classic vampire. For sleepy Idaho Falls, there was a lot of interest. Quite the stir caused by a stay-at-home mom in Arizona!)
by Jason Joyner | Jul 21, 2008 | Blog, CSFF, dragons, fantasy, speculative fiction
The CSFF tour is highlighting Donita Paul and her new book DragonLight this month.
It is the fifth and final book in the DragonKeeper Chronicles. Since it was the last in a series, I didn’t feel I could review it and do it justice.
Wait! Don’t go. I do have original content this month. Well, mostly original.
I want to ask a question. Is it a problem for any Christian readers to consider dragons as appropriate for “Christian” fiction? I am no means a dragon expert (for that, talk to Snuffles), but I wanted to discuss this idea for a minute.
Dragons have a mixed history. In Western lore and mythology, dragons were usually agents of evil. Since Revelation 12 uses a dragon as imagery for Satan, this was likely a source of dragon prejudice. An early legend of St. George defeating the dragon resonates with many cultures across Europe and some Middle Eastern areas. However, in Chinese folklore, dragons are often agents of good, a symbol of wisdom.
Dragons have had a resurgence in many arenas. The popular book Eragon has given them a good name as well as a high profile. Donita Paul’s series has not been the only Christian fiction with a dragon-centric plot. Bryan Davis has released the Dragons in Our Midst series in the CBA realm also.
Does this mean that it is okay to use dragons as a motif for a Christian tale? I’d like anyone’s opinion out there before I talk about mine. However, let me close with this quote from Bryan Davis in an interview from CBN back when his dragon books were first being released.
Siepel: What do you say to parents who may be wary of introducing their child to the world of fantasy?
Davis: We have an opportunity to create strong soldiers for Christ by using the power of story, even through the pages of the impossible. If parents will allow fantasy its proper place, as an inspiration toward holiness, allowing powerful images to create God-honoring models in children’s minds, authors will be moved to create more of those fantastic images. As the market grows, as book-buyers seek heroes displaying faith-empowered integrity and strength, more publishers will have the freedom to take a chance on these works. Working together, we can use this genre to capture hearts and minds with champions of virtue, images that will reach in and ignite the flame, setting free the hero or heroine that God has implanted in the hearts of children.
Check out the featured author links:
Web site – http://www.donitakpaul.com/
Blog – http://www.donitakpaul.com/author/.html
Also see what others are saying on the CSFF tour below!
*Participants’ Links:
(Just for fun I marked the five who also participated in CSFF’s first book tour, featuring Donita Paul’s DragonKnight back in June 2006.)
Brandon Barr
Justin Boyer
Jackie Castle
Valerie Comer
Karri Compton
CSFF Blog Tour
Gene Curtis
Stacey Dale
D. G. D. Davidson
Jeff Draper
April Erwin
Karina Fabian
* Beth Goddard
Mark Goodyear
Andrea Graham
Todd Michael Greene
Katie Hart
Christopher Hopper
Joleen Howell
Jason Joyner
Carol Keen
Magma
Terri Main
Magma
Margaret
* Shannon McNear
Melissa Meeks
* Rebecca LuElla Miller
John W. Otte
Deena Peterson
Steve Rice
* Cheryl Russel
Ashley Rutherford
Chawna Schroeder
James Somers
Robert Treskillard
* Steve Trower
Speculative Faith
Laura Williams
by Jason Joyner | Jul 21, 2008 | Blog, CSFF, dragons, fantasy, speculative fiction
The CSFF tour is highlighting Donita Paul and her new book DragonLight this month.
It is the fifth and final book in the DragonKeeper Chronicles. Since it was the last in a series, I didn’t feel I could review it and do it justice.
Wait! Don’t go. I do have original content this month. Well, mostly original.
I want to ask a question. Is it a problem for any Christian readers to consider dragons as appropriate for “Christian” fiction? I am no means a dragon expert (for that, talk to Snuffles), but I wanted to discuss this idea for a minute.
Dragons have a mixed history. In Western lore and mythology, dragons were usually agents of evil. Since Revelation 12 uses a dragon as imagery for Satan, this was likely a source of dragon prejudice. An early legend of St. George defeating the dragon resonates with many cultures across Europe and some Middle Eastern areas. However, in Chinese folklore, dragons are often agents of good, a symbol of wisdom.
Dragons have had a resurgence in many arenas. The popular book Eragon has given them a good name as well as a high profile. Donita Paul’s series has not been the only Christian fiction with a dragon-centric plot. Bryan Davis has released the Dragons in Our Midst series in the CBA realm also.
Does this mean that it is okay to use dragons as a motif for a Christian tale? I’d like anyone’s opinion out there before I talk about mine. However, let me close with this quote from Bryan Davis in an interview from CBN back when his dragon books were first being released.
Siepel: What do you say to parents who may be wary of introducing their child to the world of fantasy?
Davis: We have an opportunity to create strong soldiers for Christ by using the power of story, even through the pages of the impossible. If parents will allow fantasy its proper place, as an inspiration toward holiness, allowing powerful images to create God-honoring models in children’s minds, authors will be moved to create more of those fantastic images. As the market grows, as book-buyers seek heroes displaying faith-empowered integrity and strength, more publishers will have the freedom to take a chance on these works. Working together, we can use this genre to capture hearts and minds with champions of virtue, images that will reach in and ignite the flame, setting free the hero or heroine that God has implanted in the hearts of children.
Check out the featured author links:
Web site – http://www.donitakpaul.com/
Blog – http://www.donitakpaul.com/author/.html
Also see what others are saying on the CSFF tour below!
*Participants’ Links:
(Just for fun I marked the five who also participated in CSFF’s first book tour, featuring Donita Paul’s DragonKnight back in June 2006.)
Brandon Barr
Justin Boyer
Jackie Castle
Valerie Comer
Karri Compton
CSFF Blog Tour
Gene Curtis
Stacey Dale
D. G. D. Davidson
Jeff Draper
April Erwin
Karina Fabian
* Beth Goddard
Mark Goodyear
Andrea Graham
Todd Michael Greene
Katie Hart
Christopher Hopper
Joleen Howell
Jason Joyner
Carol Keen
Magma
Terri Main
Magma
Margaret
* Shannon McNear
Melissa Meeks
* Rebecca LuElla Miller
John W. Otte
Deena Peterson
Steve Rice
* Cheryl Russel
Ashley Rutherford
Chawna Schroeder
James Somers
Robert Treskillard
* Steve Trower
Speculative Faith
Laura Williams
